Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

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Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

Brandon Keith Biggs
Hello,
After the latest Windows update typed characters don't talk in edit boxes like cortana.
Suggestions don't talk while typing either. They talk when you arrow through them, but not while you are typing.
I also am not able to right-click on suggested apps.

The not speaking typed characters also is in the windows feedback center.
Thanks,


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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

Joseph Lee

Hi Brandon,

You are not alone in this situation. NV Access and Microsoft are aware of this issue.

Cheers,

Joseph

 

From: Brandon Keith Biggs [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2016 5:00 AM
To: NVDA screen reader development <[hidden email]>
Subject: [Nvda-devel] Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

 

Hello,

After the latest Windows update typed characters don't talk in edit boxes like cortana.

Suggestions don't talk while typing either. They talk when you arrow through them, but not while you are typing.

I also am not able to right-click on suggested apps.

The not speaking typed characters also is in the windows feedback center.

Thanks,


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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortanaafter latest Windows update

Brian's Mail list account BY
Yes I notice this and indeed in Edge sometimes when editing the fields as
well. It was working before the update as I recall. Looks like some code has
become screwed in Windows during the  update.
 I have also found that there are some strange issues with regard to viewing
messages such as when windows updates do not work. like I can here the date
and some info but the actual update text seems not to be being read in some
of the screens that can display this info.
 Its very hard to be precise however as it seems to be very hit and miss.
 I'm using Next snapshot as I had hoped this might have cured it.

Incidentally still trying to understand why the search using her launches
Edge even if firefox is the default browser. This can be very inconvenient
as when one wants to follow a search one finds no easy way to export the
result to Firefox.
 Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Lee" <[hidden email]>
To: "'NVDA screen reader development'" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2016 1:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Nvda-devel] Typed Characters not talking on boxes like
Cortanaafter latest Windows update


Hi Brandon,

You are not alone in this situation. NV Access and Microsoft are aware of
this issue.

Cheers,

Joseph



From: Brandon Keith Biggs [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2016 5:00 AM
To: NVDA screen reader development <[hidden email]>
Subject: [Nvda-devel] Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana
after latest Windows update



Hello,

After the latest Windows update typed characters don't talk in edit boxes
like cortana.

Suggestions don't talk while typing either. They talk when you arrow through
them, but not while you are typing.

I also am not able to right-click on suggested apps.

The not speaking typed characters also is in the windows feedback center.

Thanks,



Brandon Keith Biggs <http://brandonkeithbiggs.com/>




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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortanaafter latest Windows update

Mgr. Janusz Chmiel-3
Dear users and developers,
I have also noticed this behaviour while running Microsoft Edge browser.
But I like Seamonkey or Firefox, because NVDA respond much more faster
while using virtual buffer browsing mode. So it is no problem for Me.
I can also Use Iexplore.exe and it work with like like a charm. Sono issue.
Windows 10 update have brought many positive thinks including
reprogrammed device drivers for integrated sound chips.
In this aspect, i strongly recommend all users who have got their
notebooks and computers preinstalled from manufacturer, do not remove
their various programs by using add or remove programs in control panel.
Because Windows update recognizes installed programs and for example,
Toshiba do not offer their specialised useful utilities for WIndows 10
for my older model Toshiba satellite. Fortunately, crucial installers
such as sound and graphic cart drivers are being very ofter downloaded
by using Windows update automatically even if user will remove them.
Because Microsoft have enabled users to download sound and other
specific manufacturers drivers by using WIndows update directly.


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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

James Teh
In reply to this post by Brandon Keith Biggs

We need to update our official Windows 10 statement on this I think. In short, Microsoft made a security decision to block any application, even a trusted screen reader, from injecting its code into any WinRT application. That includes core components such as the Start Menu, the Settings app and Microsoft Edge, as well as all Windows Store apps. Unfortunately, this blocks the only way we can currently fully access typed characters. We made Microsoft aware of this issue months ago, but they refused to reverse this decision and have not yet provided an adequate alternative. We are still working with them on a suitable alternative.


Jamie

On 20/08/2016 10:00 PM, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote:
Hello,
After the latest Windows update typed characters don't talk in edit boxes like cortana.
Suggestions don't talk while typing either. They talk when you arrow through them, but not while you are typing.
I also am not able to right-click on suggested apps.

The not speaking typed characters also is in the windows feedback center.
Thanks,



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-- 
James Teh
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
Ph +61 7 3149 3306
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
SIP: [hidden email]

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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

Brandon Keith Biggs
More votes it gets, greater chance Microsoft will act on this problem.
Thanks,



On Sun, Aug 21, 2016 at 3:39 PM, James Teh <[hidden email]> wrote:

We need to update our official Windows 10 statement on this I think. In short, Microsoft made a security decision to block any application, even a trusted screen reader, from injecting its code into any WinRT application. That includes core components such as the Start Menu, the Settings app and Microsoft Edge, as well as all Windows Store apps. Unfortunately, this blocks the only way we can currently fully access typed characters. We made Microsoft aware of this issue months ago, but they refused to reverse this decision and have not yet provided an adequate alternative. We are still working with them on a suitable alternative.


Jamie

On 20/08/2016 10:00 PM, Brandon Keith Biggs wrote:
Hello,
After the latest Windows update typed characters don't talk in edit boxes like cortana.
Suggestions don't talk while typing either. They talk when you arrow through them, but not while you are typing.
I also am not able to right-click on suggested apps.

The not speaking typed characters also is in the windows feedback center.
Thanks,



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-- 
James Teh
Executive Director, NV Access Limited
Ph <a href="tel:%2B61%207%203149%203306" value="+61731493306" target="_blank">+61 7 3149 3306
www.nvaccess.org
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/NVAccess
Twitter: @NVAccess
SIP: [hidden email]

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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

Mgr. Janusz Chmiel-3
Dear users and developers,
I think, that Microsoft is being afraid, that used NVDA algorithm for
detecting key presses inside some windows would be used by hackers to
create trojan horses and other kind of viruses.
Try to use official Microsoft Narrator if it will enable you to read
typed characters.
If Microsoft will not provide information for NVDA developers, may be,
that NVDA will stop to be opensource and Microsoft will create their
libraryin C++ by using most strongest obfuscator technologyavailable,
encryption and NVDA core developers will have to call their API function.
Or Microsoft will reveal little part of Narrator algorithm to NVDA
developers.
But I think, that Microsoft have good will to cooperate on accessibility
issues, but in some cases, good will can be misused by software
criminals, who would use some parts of NVDA source code as a example how
viruses would be created.
So even though Microsoft trust NVDA developers and NVaccess, they must
be careful. Because trojan horses and various viruses, which are being
intercepting keyboard shortcuts aare being used more and more by
software criminals.
So we must be very diplomatic and polite while discussing this
accessibility issue.
It is not war against visually impaired or NVDA developers.
So please, if somebody will post message to Microsoft accessibility
thread, do not be arrogant. I think it good with all of us.
Security situation related to viruses is being more and more complicated.



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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

Brandon Keith Biggs
Hello,
I think the problem of access is much much bigger than the problem of a virus. There are easy ways around blocking viruses and practical steps one can take to block them from coming onto your computer. Microsoft has done a great job with this.
The problem is that Microsoft broke this huge accessibility feature without even considering its blind stakeholders. They have no infrastructure in place to efficiently consider every stakeholder in their features.
If they do, then they are saying that access for blind people is less important than viruses on a few computers.

I'm not 100% sure of the process, but couldn't they make the events duplicated in some way so MS gets one event and external apps get the same event but not in a way where they can block it? Then all people would need to worry about are key loggers.
But frankly Microsoft's virus teem needs to sit down with screen reader developers and hash out a new system for reading events without allowing that many viruses to take hold.
I just see Microsoft blocking more access to screen readers as time goes on so they can get rid of more and more viruses.
Narrator, according to Microsoft, never will be any replacement for a screen reader like NVDA. So I can't take it seriously until they change their stance. It is currently more difficult to use than NVDA and less functional, two problems that shouldn't be found together.
Thanks,



On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 2:41 AM, Mgr. Janusz Chmiel <[hidden email]> wrote:
Dear users and developers,
I think, that Microsoft is being afraid, that used NVDA algorithm for
detecting key presses inside some windows would be used by hackers to
create trojan horses and other kind of viruses.
Try to use official Microsoft Narrator if it will enable you to read
typed characters.
If Microsoft will not provide information for NVDA developers, may be,
that NVDA will stop to be opensource and Microsoft will create their
libraryin C++ by using most strongest obfuscator technologyavailable,
encryption and NVDA core developers will have to call their API function.
Or Microsoft will reveal little part of Narrator algorithm to NVDA
developers.
But I think, that Microsoft have good will to cooperate on accessibility
issues, but in some cases, good will can be misused by software
criminals, who would use some parts of NVDA source code as a example how
viruses would be created.
So even though Microsoft trust NVDA developers and NVaccess, they must
be careful. Because trojan horses and various viruses, which are being
intercepting keyboard shortcuts aare being used more and more by
software criminals.
So we must be very diplomatic and polite while discussing this
accessibility issue.
It is not war against visually impaired or NVDA developers.
So please, if somebody will post message to Microsoft accessibility
thread, do not be arrogant. I think it good with all of us.
Security situation related to viruses is being more and more complicated.



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https://www.avast.com/antivirus


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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortana after latest Windows update

James Teh
In reply to this post by Mgr. Janusz Chmiel-3
It's true that Narrator can speak typed characters without injection. However, this almost certainly won't work for certain characters in certain languages and also doesn't work reliably at this point. The plan is to come up with a way to get equivalent access to what NVDA has now using an API that doesn't require injection, but this requires changes in Windows itself.

Sent from a mobile device

> On 22 Aug 2016, at 7:41 PM, Mgr. Janusz Chmiel <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Dear users and developers,
> I think, that Microsoft is being afraid, that used NVDA algorithm for
> detecting key presses inside some windows would be used by hackers to
> create trojan horses and other kind of viruses.
> Try to use official Microsoft Narrator if it will enable you to read
> typed characters.
> If Microsoft will not provide information for NVDA developers, may be,
> that NVDA will stop to be opensource and Microsoft will create their
> libraryin C++ by using most strongest obfuscator technologyavailable,
> encryption and NVDA core developers will have to call their API function.
> Or Microsoft will reveal little part of Narrator algorithm to NVDA
> developers.
> But I think, that Microsoft have good will to cooperate on accessibility
> issues, but in some cases, good will can be misused by software
> criminals, who would use some parts of NVDA source code as a example how
> viruses would be created.
> So even though Microsoft trust NVDA developers and NVaccess, they must
> be careful. Because trojan horses and various viruses, which are being
> intercepting keyboard shortcuts aare being used more and more by
> software criminals.
> So we must be very diplomatic and polite while discussing this
> accessibility issue.
> It is not war against visually impaired or NVDA developers.
> So please, if somebody will post message to Microsoft accessibility
> thread, do not be arrogant. I think it good with all of us.
> Security situation related to viruses is being more and more complicated.
>
>
>
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> Tato zpráva byla zkontrolována na viry programem Avast Antivirus.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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>
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Re: Typed Characters not talking on boxes like Cortanaafter latest Windows update

Brian's Mail list account BY
Yes its really annoying on the edge browser as well, and I'm sure it was
working at least part of the time before the anniversary update on the next
branch.
OK so they bodged Narrator as they know their own code one supposes. If this
is all they can do then its pretty poor.
 Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "James Teh" <[hidden email]>
To: "NVDA screen reader development" <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Nvda-devel] Typed Characters not talking on boxes like
Cortanaafter latest Windows update


> It's true that Narrator can speak typed characters without injection.
> However, this almost certainly won't work for certain characters in
> certain languages and also doesn't work reliably at this point. The plan
> is to come up with a way to get equivalent access to what NVDA has now
> using an API that doesn't require injection, but this requires changes in
> Windows itself.
>
> Sent from a mobile device
>
>> On 22 Aug 2016, at 7:41 PM, Mgr. Janusz Chmiel <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear users and developers,
>> I think, that Microsoft is being afraid, that used NVDA algorithm for
>> detecting key presses inside some windows would be used by hackers to
>> create trojan horses and other kind of viruses.
>> Try to use official Microsoft Narrator if it will enable you to read
>> typed characters.
>> If Microsoft will not provide information for NVDA developers, may be,
>> that NVDA will stop to be opensource and Microsoft will create their
>> libraryin C++ by using most strongest obfuscator technologyavailable,
>> encryption and NVDA core developers will have to call their API function.
>> Or Microsoft will reveal little part of Narrator algorithm to NVDA
>> developers.
>> But I think, that Microsoft have good will to cooperate on accessibility
>> issues, but in some cases, good will can be misused by software
>> criminals, who would use some parts of NVDA source code as a example how
>> viruses would be created.
>> So even though Microsoft trust NVDA developers and NVaccess, they must
>> be careful. Because trojan horses and various viruses, which are being
>> intercepting keyboard shortcuts aare being used more and more by
>> software criminals.
>> So we must be very diplomatic and polite while discussing this
>> accessibility issue.
>> It is not war against visually impaired or NVDA developers.
>> So please, if somebody will post message to Microsoft accessibility
>> thread, do not be arrogant. I think it good with all of us.
>> Security situation related to viruses is being more and more complicated.
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> Tato zpráva byla zkontrolována na viry programem Avast Antivirus.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>
>>
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>> [hidden email]
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